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Debating Evil
Posted: 19 Nov 2003 12:15 PM |
Save the seal! Debate evil HERE!
(Please, Alo, move those other posts debating evil over here too)
I don't think everyone -should- be equal. After all not all characters are going to be built for running down and capturing Character X. Look at it like this.
*Mage see's thief grab purse and run*
*Mage is rather shocked at the moment and must react*
*Mage starts running after thief and because everyone is equal, he catches the thief*
Ermmm... that sounds a bit much, don't ya think? Granted, the mage could cast hold person upon the thief. Lets put it in a Paladins point of view.
*Paladin sees thief grab purse and run*
*Paladin starts chasing thief*
*Paladin is sprinting in 50lb plate mail + whatever is in pack*
*Paladin never loses an ounce of strength because of game mechanics*
Meanwhile, the thief in question should be able to run longer, faster, and easier because the thief is wearing either a suit of leather or a plain old set of clothes and about 50 lbs of loot. So, if possible, it should be a simple dice roll tumble v. reflex when and if the fighter gets within 3' or so of the character (like, | | <-- that close, IG).
IMHO
Tasra (the Great!) |
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Re: Debating Evil
Posted: 19 Nov 2003 12:35 PM |
lol.. i think this post of yours is suposed to go to the other thread =p
and i will remind everyone again..
not all thieves are -evil-!
debating on thieves will goto the other thread (well.. the options on catching them)
and debating evil.. and as you said 'evil community' is here..
and i'll start the debate with the questions i asked there (hopefully the posts will be moved so i wont need to repeat myself ^^ )
till then.. i'll just say -
I am pretty much against starting to talk about guilds in the forums.. you can post 'notes' or such.. (cuz AFAIK the bulletin boards are not too much.. wel.. presistant.. and also this is easier =p)
maybe polishing out ideas before.. but only the basic of what stands behind a guild.. and then when you come Ig.. you wont start "i think we need a guild, period" *someone throws a tomato at the speaker and the audience goes away*
but i do think that starting the guild itself here.. is not good as well.. after all.. your chars will need to create the guild rules.. and decide for themselves.. maybe your evil chars dont really want to take a part in a community.. maybe all they wanna do is be left out alone?
Dens |
You are more than welcome to ignore my spelling mistakes =p |
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Re: Debating Evil
Posted: 19 Nov 2003 03:16 PM |
| I'm yet to figure out how anyone got "Guild" out of what I've said on ANY of the threads. Alo, please help us. These posts are all over the place ATM. ACK! |
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Re: Debating Evil
Posted: 19 Nov 2003 08:15 PM |
Tasra, what i think Dens is saying is that there is a difference between debating evil, and someone getting caught, or being chased, for pilfering a bit of food of items from the local market, and setting up a system in game to help facillitate in confrontations when these things happen. So Dens is saying go to the other thread for posting on setting up a system for bandit confrontations between PC's, but stay here if you want to debate the nature of evil and the role of evil characters on the server. Did i get that right Dens?
The biggest problem with evil, as i see it, is exactly what Tasra posted and what you said, Dens. STEALING DOES NOT MAKE YOU EVIL. My character, Veshtan, believes that in certain situations, there is nothing wrong with stealing. Hence why he is chaotic good. If someone is in need, or if he feels the law is plain wrong about something, he will go against it to do what he feels is right. That doesn't make him evil. It simply means he's not willing to obey the letter of the law, and sometimes not even it's intent. He is willing instead to obey his heart, which could get him in trouble, but doesn't make him an evil villian. Most times he obeys the law because he sees no reason not to.
Now stealing just because you want to, or stealing because you want to hear the shopkeepers wail when he finds out he's been robbed, that could quite possibly make you evil. The biggest problem with evil is it's based on perceptions, and every person's perception is different. And it can also be very situational. Like in what i mentioned above about stealing from a shopkeeper to hear him scream. Perhaps you're a neutral or maybe even a good thief, and this shopkeeper is price gouging, and charging much more then he should for items. Perhaps he's even gotten these items through an unlawful manner. Would it not then be poetic justice to relieve him of his ill-gotten gains?
As to guilds. I do think that if the evil characters have a notion to form their own guild, they should be allowed to, and helped by the DM's to do so. It's far from fair to setup a guild for justice and the defense of all and then not allow the evil doers to have their own coallition. Besides, that could lead to all sorts of interesting stories of the bad guys stabbing each other in the back to gain supremecy *winks* |
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Re: Debating Evil
Posted: 20 Nov 2003 04:45 AM |
Stealing is listed in the Book of Viles Darkness in the "Evil Acts" section. However, it is one of the evil acts which can have mitigating circumstances, and thus not be evil. Just like killing an evil person, or killing to save someone, isn't evil.
Whether or not an act like stealing is evil or not is entirely circumstancial, IMHO.
I suppose the next "problem" with evil is that not everyone's definition of an evil character will be the same. Expecially with the boundaries between low end neutral and evil. For example, take a character who simply doesn't care for the feelings of others. Thus, he will rob, harm others, and perform other such acts because the feelings of others simply have no sway on him? Is he evil? I would say yes, since his lack of care for others impacts directly on them lowering their quality of life. Thus; evil. However, it could be said that since the acts are not performed TO harm the person, rather out of not caring for them, that the character is actually low end neutral. Bad example; I'll accept that. But it's the best I can think of right now, so I'm sure, however, that you get the idea.
Yeah. I suppose the thing is; never judge an action or character solely in terms of alignment. Especially when discussiong such things as stealing, or forming an "evil" group or whatever. I KNOW THAT YOU HAVN'T SAID THAT YET TASRA :P |
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Re: Debating Evil
Posted: 20 Nov 2003 08:39 AM |
I thought your example was a good one, Barnas. (Uh-oh. Agreed twice in a row with him. Must have head axamined. *just kidding*)
And Veshtan, that is why Lawful folk think people who follow their consciences are in favor of Chaos. Because we all have a slightly, or sometimes greatly, different concept of right and wrong. At least that is how I interpret Chaotic versus Lawful. Encoding right and wrong in a set of laws creates perfect Order. |
Dieties preserve us from the evil chaotics named Lag, Crash, and Server Reset.
PCs: Loli Dankirk (Ftr 18/Brd 8.5 @ 1777 hrs) left Vives for Origins; Gnora Gnombody (Sor 5 @ 54 hrs) and Amanda Stark (Wiz 3 @ ~10 hrs) left Vives for Feline Providence. |
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Re: Debating Evil
Posted: 20 Nov 2003 12:03 PM |
| *Sighs* I feel so very, very confused right now. Evil is just not on my mind today. All I can think is "How the blazes are you getting those italics?" and "I shouldn't have woken up so early today" |
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