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If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 28 Sep 2003 03:10 PM |
...feel free to hand it into your friendly neighourhood DM's :)
A while back, Loli Dankirk and Shaz'jen found a belt of Sharran evilness - +4 Strength, +2 Ac, Magic Circle vs Alignment 1/day. Now, not really wanting to sell such a powerful item to be dispesed amongst the less scrupulous of people, Shaz kept hold of the belt until he could have it cleansed by the Midoran priests.
The moral of the story? If you find items that are too powerful, e.g. +4 to an ability etc, then turn it into the DM's. Such items shouldn't be around, and they are more than happy to reward your efforts, whether as a small plot or an OOC mention, with items, gold, and experience :) |
- Who needs Epic Levels when you have Epic Eyebrows? |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 28 Sep 2003 03:12 PM |
| dang.. and I've just been throwing such things in the trashing, not knowing what they were of course |
~Alosynth
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 28 Sep 2003 03:30 PM |
um, define "absurdly powerful" please.
last i heard, it was only the +5 items what were verboten. not that i ever have found anything even approaching in power the item described above...but...according to earlier discussions on this board, that one would not fall under the previously defined standard.
it would be nice to know what is not allowed, and should be turned in. |
But long ago he rode away
And where he dwelleth none can say |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 28 Sep 2003 04:13 PM |
| The guideline is +3 to any ability or stat, Merlin. That should be the top end. |
Question Authority! |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 28 Sep 2003 06:44 PM |
The PDf file says +4 is allowed. I'm not arguing if you say otherwise is the new rule, just pointing out that the rules we download and agree to say that.
So I guess I'm not going to talk anyone into trading this +5 ring for a +4, for a change, instead of a +3. Fudge. ;) |
Dieties preserve us from the evil chaotics named Lag, Crash, and Server Reset.
PCs: Loli Dankirk (Ftr 18/Brd 8.5 @ 1777 hrs) left Vives for Origins; Gnora Gnombody (Sor 5 @ 54 hrs) and Amanda Stark (Wiz 3 @ ~10 hrs) left Vives for Feline Providence. |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 28 Sep 2003 11:49 PM |
The guideline is +3 to any ability or stat, Merlin. That should be the top end.
um, says who, landru?
i know you are an admin, but other admins *and* the published docs say otherwise.
i want to abide by the rules...but let's be clear on what the rules *are*, yes? aria has told me directly, IG, that +4 fortitude save rings are ok. that was a while back, true...
let me be really clear about my intentions. i am *not* trying to be whiny or difficult. but this one is a big deal to have clear. all i ask is...you guys talk amongst yourselves and agree on what is kosher and what is not, then tell us.
fair? |
But long ago he rode away
And where he dwelleth none can say |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 29 Sep 2003 12:03 AM |
'Allow' has taken on dual meanings here, so let me try to clarify.
+5 items are NOT allowed. That much is clear by all definitions. Same goes with perma-haste/truesight etc..
+4 items (to ability/saves) are 'allowed' in the sense that they could appear in-game, and are 'not allowed' in the sense that they should not be consequence of a random-loot by player (that is, +4 items are strictly DM-quest rewards and not 'lootable' as it has been implicitedly implied thru-out the thread)
+3 items are allowed (you can acquire them thru trade/craft/loot etc. in additional to DM'mediated quests)
Hope that clarifies. |
Aria
So talented, so troubled. |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 29 Sep 2003 12:51 AM |
Thanks for the clarification Aria.
Sorry for the unclear answer earlier Merlin... I was in a hurry, but wanted to get you something by way of answer. ;) |
Question Authority! |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 29 Sep 2003 02:02 AM |
kewl beans, folks.
thanks very much. now we all know where we stand, and where the line is drawn.
very excellent. thank you again, to both. :) |
But long ago he rode away
And where he dwelleth none can say |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 29 Sep 2003 01:32 PM |
Hmm ok.
This came about by me introducing the new SoU treasure table random loot generator. I basically slapped a load of magical items in various loot tables (high, medium, low, unique etc)......
... and.... erm......
.....erm...
.... couldn't be arsed to check some of the stats on various items as it was taking too long hehe :/
However...... in the new areas I'm working on I've been using area specific tables..... so for example..... in a monastery one might find shuriken and monk clobber..... in a mage tower one would tend to find scrolls and such etc etc.....
I will (honest :P) get around to finalising the tables this weekend for the overall system (and removing those old barrels and such still utilising the old system that on occasion sometimes spew up some annoyingly powerful items.
Cheers!
Ara |
Vives Screenshots!
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 29 Sep 2003 09:04 PM |
.... couldn't be arsed to check some of the stats on various items as it was taking too long hehe :/
Actually, in the Unique category almost all the items are everything against what we want to see (tons of perma-haste/truesight, immunities etc.) that are random loot and we have no knowledge of or control over. This served to remind me of emptying all of them when I next open the mod, and to remind everyone else that if something is absurdly powerful, it's probably because Ara can't be arsed 
Gotta love Ara the lil' rascal 
Let us know and we'll compensate you with something slightly more logical. |
Aria
So talented, so troubled. |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 30 Sep 2003 01:51 AM |
Ara: Do you have documentations for the BW new chest-based 1.31 TT documentations around? Alo and I came up with a pretty neat idea that will enable us to easily customize the drops to Vives, and delegate the work to DMs instead of having us to verify item properties of everything. The plan is to couple our persistenr chest with their system  |
Aria
So talented, so troubled. |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 30 Sep 2003 12:14 PM |
Well, Aria, I found something by Neek, it was a pair of ithican throat cutters... (A couple Haul-Arse shortswords perfect for the Kender that found them). I gave them back to Neek, but when I hinted some experience (about 5,000) wouldn't go awry, he said he couldn't do this. I talked to my Dad about the whole thing (Him being an ex-DM) he said I should have bargained with Neek for him to get these things back.
So the questions are these:
Should I ask for the XP?
Do I deserve the XP?
And am I wasting your time? |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 30 Sep 2003 12:25 PM |
| First of all Tashra, you didn't give those things back to Neek. You gave them to a DM (we will not mention his name). I far as a reward goes, it seems he Raised you from the dead and gave you two quivers of arrows to boot! I think you where more than justly rewarded. |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 30 Sep 2003 01:04 PM |
| Do I have to turn in my Vorpal Spork-Of-Doom +5? :) |
I'm The Cult of Personality. |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 30 Sep 2003 01:32 PM |
The only items that really need returning are those that give perma-haste or true-seeing, OR obscenely large resistances (with this I am talking slash.pierce etc and being anything of 10 or over). Plus any Stat (Str, Int, Dex etc) boosting equipment over +3.... (+3 is fine, +4's will exist but will be DM led Quest items..... +5's will only ever occur once (if at all) and will never come into being again).
These are unbalancing. If you return it to the DM they will be replaced with a more "appropriate" item.
Aria: All the system is is basically...... they turned the tables into chests that one can place exactly what one wants in it in the toolset or even in game whilst as a DM.
However, you can also make area-specific tables which I am doing for the new areas I'm working on..... and will gradually roll-out where appropriate when time allows.
Cheers
Ara |
Vives Screenshots!
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 30 Sep 2003 04:19 PM |
Actually, a question from the poster.. :P
Where do skill raises come into this? Or, say, spells an item can cast? |
- Who needs Epic Levels when you have Epic Eyebrows? |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 30 Sep 2003 07:36 PM |
Well Neek, the raise would have happened eventually with or without the items. The 2 quivers of arrows... well... I don't think 2 quivers of arrows well replaces 2 Ithican Throat Cutters... Especially since they were really the perfect shortswords for my Kender...
All in all, if you want to reward me, that's fine, but do it. If not, that's also fine, but say it, don't try weaving around it. We aren't in politics here ya know. |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 30 Sep 2003 08:31 PM |
Let me get this straight... We're supposed to give you XP and item rewards for following the rules?
Having an orderly server, with proper RPers to play with, should be reward enough, IMO...
Let me just say that I think it's very bad form to ask for XP to begin with... Earn it!
of course, those are my opinions and may mor may not reflect those of other DMs. |
Question Authority! |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 30 Sep 2003 08:59 PM |
Ara-the-big-lil'-rascal
Aria: All the system is is basically...... they turned the tables into chests that one can place exactly what one wants in it in the toolset or even in game whilst as a DM.
However, you can also make area-specific tables which I am doing for the new areas I'm working on..... and will gradually roll-out where appropriate when time allows.
Do you have specifications/documentations that you can link me? I need to know whether something can or cannot be tampered with before trying to play with the consequences. If we can let DMs place items on-the-fly and make them persist across reset, it can fly (given some DMs would like to populate the chests)
And the documentations would give me some clue as to how to make Area/creature-specific tables
--
Tasra:
Should I ask for the XP?
Do I deserve the XP?
And am I wasting your time?
(1) No.
(2) No.
(3) No, because it brings up a good point for discussion.
Most players recognize that this is a small sacrifice for the health of the economy as a whole. See PhoenixFlamehart and Alo's posts:
[Alo.] ...and I've just been throwing such things in the trashing
DMs have freedom to deal with these instances at their own discretion.
On a personal note, this is what I would do as well if a player attempts to bargain with me on what is apparently an unintended design flaw.
--
Birdie
Where do skill raises come into this? Or, say, spells an item can cast?
As of now, we're generally not looking at skill-raises/spell-casts particularly; this may change if it turns out on the longer run of events some items are drastically unbalancing. The current restrictions are from the experience of DM/Admins' own experiences as players, and unfortunately none of us are particularly well-versed in mechanics (okok except Fen ) |
Aria
So talented, so troubled. |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 01 Oct 2003 11:02 AM |
ok.. first things first,
-dont- ask for xp.. if you think something is unfair (like veryone in the party was rewarded and you didnt tho you did the exact same stuff) ask/talkabout the reason, DMs -make- mistakes, and maybe they just skipped ya.. but maybe you didnt deserve it..
also, you shouldnt decide you are suposed to be rewarded, the DMs will decide that for you..
and anyway.. 5k xp? is that some kinda of a joke? =p
(as a side note, and just to make it clear.. saying something like : "can i get xp?" or "you should give me xp for that.." will get ya some negative XPs so think about it..)
seconed, items like these are not suposed to be out there.. so either you will wait and keep them.. and they will be taken by DMs.. or you can keep and use them.. and they will be taken by DMs and you will get frowned upon (a note, DM frown is -not- a good thing =P) or you can follow the rules, and throw them to the trash or turn them in to a DM... but only the DM will decide wether you get something for it or not.
(as a note, sometimes i replace magical items and sometimes i -dont- and my decision is final [was pointed at Barnas])
well Tasra, if you think being rezed is not something really importent i guess i will need to remmember that for next times i login as DM and think about healing ppl (rezing ppl as well)
( a note here - i wasnt the DM that rezed ya )
most importent thing -
if a DM make a decision, you might ask once or twice about it, but :
a. dont annoy with that question.. DM might make his decision less.. fair..
b. when a DM make a decision that is final .. other Dms you know wont change that (so maybe your father would have done that.. I know i would take them away (especially since they are 'illegal') or maybe would give you some other item.. but certinly not xp.. and if you ask for xp from me i will take some of the points you got)
c. if you really think something unfair happend, tell that to an admin, and he will talk to the DM or other admins.. or post that on one of the forums.. that is the only way to change a decision..
hmm sorry if this was a bit offensive thread, but i had to point that at someone or it would loose it's point..
and I wanna rant about players from time to time ;)
and i guess Aria said the answera for your questions:
"
Should I ask for the XP?
Do I deserve the XP?
And am I wasting your time?
(1) No.
(2) No.
(3) No, because it brings up a good point for discussion.
"
also.. getting offensive to DMs is not reccomended, especially when they decided about the case (that's not for DM only that's for real life too! =P)
not to mention we are here to have fun.. not to flame each other..
Dens |
You are more than welcome to ignore my spelling mistakes =p |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 01 Oct 2003 12:08 PM |
| Aye yi yi... I should just shut up on these forums... it seems each time I open my mouth I make myself seem more and more like a jerk. |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 01 Oct 2003 02:44 PM |
*nervously clears throat*
What if you've run something by a DM, and been allowed to keep it? How do the other DMs know it's OK and that they shouldn't *shudder* frown at you? I hasten to add that it is a non-combat skill that is enhanced by the object.
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Dieties preserve us from the evil chaotics named Lag, Crash, and Server Reset.
PCs: Loli Dankirk (Ftr 18/Brd 8.5 @ 1777 hrs) left Vives for Origins; Gnora Gnombody (Sor 5 @ 54 hrs) and Amanda Stark (Wiz 3 @ ~10 hrs) left Vives for Feline Providence. |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 01 Oct 2003 03:14 PM |
then you go saying:
/dm hmm, i got this by a DM...
if you know who was it.. then you will say his name and you keep unlese he says otherwise.. and then you got even more frowned =P
or you duno who was it, and tell it to a DM and then the DMs ask around who gave it..
and you keep it till it is cleared out..
anyway... i was reffering to the items that are -not- suposed to be out there.. not even DM given..
(+4/+5 enchantment bonus or higher then +4 to ability or perma haste or something)
and again, if i sounded a bit offensive... it wasnt suposed to be the idea..
i just wanted to make sure my idea (of DMs' dicision and xp requests) will pass, and while saying 'if one... if one...' it wont pass it in the same way..
and Tasra.. seems like it was a bit too harsh for ya.. didnt try to bash ya or anything.. dont think that's a reason for leaving the forums, cuz of some critisizm,
well bottom line.. i dont really mean to be offensive unlese .. well.. I bet you will get when i try to be really offensive =P
cheers
Dens - didnt mean to offend anyone, and surely not to scare anyone =P
P.S.
Barnas got yer msg, and i know it was a joke but it was getting annoying to hear about that sword..
hope i didnt offend, but i needed to point at something =p |
You are more than welcome to ignore my spelling mistakes =p |
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Re: If One Finds an Absurdly Powerful Item...
Posted: 01 Oct 2003 03:31 PM |
**Whispering from a dark corner**
I don't intend to leave the forums, just keep my mouth shut |
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