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Let's talk about roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 12:21 AM |
I'm starting this thread as a serious discussion about roleplaying in Vives. I'd like to hear all of your thoughts and ideas on what's good roleplay, what's bad roleplay, and ideas about roleplay here in general. It will help us all to grow as roleplayers to hear the perspectives of others. But first, some ground rules, to keep us going...
1. NO Flaming. I will delete flames immediately.
2. Please do not single out individuals in this thread. Speak in general, constructive terms.
3. Keep an open mind
That's about it... Players and DMs alike, let's keep this thread as an ongoing discussion about roleplay in Vives. |
Question Authority! |
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Re: Let's talk about roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 10:24 AM |
IMO I think that depending on the storyline roleplaying depends on information, both the ig information and the ooc information which is somethimes a little lacking. If im in a storyline I try to give the PC that Im rping with as much information as the character would have / if they make a conection then thats up to the PC.
I think that Vives is blessed with some amazing role players, but somethimes there are limits (sometimes) to what people can do without little bits of background information
Look forward to rping with everyone
Calia / Carlton |
Its easy clinging to your moral high ground when you have everything, try it when you have nothing left.
Cain Angus |
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Re: Let's talk about roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 10:41 AM |
Pretty open-ended topic, so I've been thinking about why it's being raised up, and what points to focus on. I've no clear idea as to either, so I'll start the ramble ;)
From other threads, I get the impression that my idea of RPing in Vives differs from what some or all of the designers and DMs feel it should be. In Vives, I've seen a handful of wonderful characters that through creative use of descriptive text add a dimension beyond the 2 dimensional world we're 'living' in. I get tremendous enjoyment from that, and when my chars meet those chars, the bar is raised for me to try to match that ability to set a mood or a tone or an atmosphere.
That said, I also enjoy other aspects of Vives - and I said as much to a relevant question(s) on my player application when I first joined.
1) I like the detail of the world. For the most part, it's well developed, with creative use of the toolset, hakpak items, etc. that make it interesting to see. Which takes me to..
2) Exploration. I want my chars to be able to see more of the world. Lately, my highest level character has seen a ridiculous amount of new (to him) areas - and there's every indication it's only the tip of the iceberg. I enjoy exploring the world itself. In order to do that, a given char needs to have the ability to survive in ...
3) Combat. I get significant enjoyment in solving tactical problems. I wish I were more successful at it, but there it is... I enjoy the PvE aspect of Vives. Another aspect of the player app I completed indicated this as well (I wish I could still view the app... I'd like to see if my original perspective has changed over these past three months).
So, RP for me adds depth to the world. I do not see it as the 'end' but a means to the end. It adds a dimension to the depth of detail, exploration, and combat activities for my characters. All in all, I'd rather have a reason to kill my 10,000th Gladden Hills troll. (Incidentally, I have a particular OOC hatred of them as they'd hindered my characters' ability to explore Asashi and Ferein for the longest time. One of my chars makes it his business to clear them out at least once a day ).
The 2 dollar question then is ... does my play style and enjoyment fit with what is 'allowed' by the vision of the designers and DMs? More directly, am I in conflict with that 'vision' and will these different views ultimately lead to disatisfaction for either me, the player, or the DMs/builders that lovingly tailor the environment that my characters swim in?
[I hope this is the type of conversation you're trying to stoke up Landru... if not then... disregard this post in it's entirety ] |
-æsir
"The man that finds himself at a crossroads, and unsure of direction, is not lost. For in truth, all roads will carry him to the same destination - his fate. But it is the determined man that takes the next step." -Aren
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Re: Let's talk about roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 11:30 AM |
As Aesir said, this is a very broad topic and at first I was at a loss as to where to go with it. Ive decided to talk about one specific revelation ive had regarding my own role playing. Im not sure if this will be of any use to any of you, but what the heck.
I had noticed a tendency in myself to have my characters become rather inactive in large group settings when there is alot of interaction going on. I wondered why that was. Recently it occured to me, this is a direct result of my years DMing PnP. When the players were busy interacting amongst themselves, I would take the back seat and just listen in, it wasnt until they all turned back to me that I would start to perform again. I find myself doing the same thing now in Vives, and I think that this is a habit I need to break.
So if you find Lirnna or whomever of my characters, in the middle of a crowd with a blank expression, feel free to drag them into activity. |
Three sisters, born of the Sea
A sad fate t'was in store for thee
Oh Vaisha, Vahlah and Vallaesha |
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Re: Let's talk about roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 01:46 PM |
I had noticed a tendency in myself to have my characters become rather inactive in large group settings when there is alot of interaction going on.
I too have found myself doing that same thing, although for me it is a different reason. Often when there is a lot going on I both want to observe everything and not miss a single word, and I also do not want to add anyconfusion. This is "bad" as it goes against what roleplaying is to me. Roleplaying to me is exactly that, playing a role. It is just like if you had a character in an improv stage production, you have to be able to think like that character would, and react to situations as they would. Sometimes this can be very difficult though, ie when you are playing a character that is definately not like the person you are in the real world. So again sometimes I faulter in not being able to decide what a character would do in a certain situation. All this just means I need to observe others of a similar character type both in game and in the real world as well, to gather information and better my play. I hope this made sense.
-Calmeir |
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Re: Let's talk about roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 01:58 PM |
Here are some of my thoughts on roleplaying...
Roleplaying is all about the character. It's about consistency. It's staying in character all the time, even when nobody's watching. It's about being true to what your character would do, in all situations. It's the paladin who won't open a crate in a house and loot it, even when there's nobody around. It's the good cleric who won't resurrect an evil character. It's the player who doesn't walk up to a character they've never met and call them by their name because it's displayed above their head. It's about being completely ignorant about something the character doesn't know about, although the player has been reading the story in great detail on the forums. It's all of these things, but primarily, it's consistent... It doesn't vary according to who's watching, or what's known ooc, or what might be gained otherwise.
Good roleplay to me means doing things that are appropriate to the situation. It's not the person who walks up and whacks on a Midor guard and then doesn't expect to be arrested, tried, and possibly executed (permanently). It's not treating a god casually, or even with contempt and expecting that god to do nothing to punish them. It means roleplaying death as if it were a very real thing, not a DM-click fix, or a click on the respawn button. It's not expecting that fix, it's planning to not need that fix, by employing common sense.
To me, roleplaying is the end here. It's the reason everything else in the world here exists. It's not an accessory, it's the purpose of the world. Vives is here to give a backdrop to the players who roleplay in it. It serves to provide an environment that players can use, as a great big prop, for their characters to literally live their life, and grow, as individuals.
Aesir, I hope this provides some perspective on where I intended for this thread to go. We (the DM staff) want to have an open, long-running dialogue that is beneficial to both sides, one that allows all of us to learn, and to become the best roleplayers we can possibly be. |
Question Authority! |
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Re: Let's talk about roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 03:04 PM |
Landru brings up good points. Its very important that you maintain the integrity of the character you are playing. And RPing all the time has its advantages. You may think no one is watching you, but they may be. A character could be hidden or a DM may be around. As an example, one time I was playing Vahlah and no one seemed to be around. I had her chatting with Cara (the little girl who lost her teddy) and Cara started talking back. It turned into an enjoyable little RP encounter. Staying in character all the time has its rewards.
Its important to work out a characters beliefs and stick to them in your RP efforts. Think of your character as a living person, not a bunch of numbers. Get inside their head and understand their motivations. I like to write a few things down for each of my characters, like quotes and such, and I try to look the notes over before I load up the character, so I am ready to be IC from the moment they appear in Vives.
Now, none of us are perfect, we all have bad days.... i find my RP can go from good to bad in a minute. Long day at the office sapping the creativeness out of my soul or whatever. The point is that this that these are the sort of things you want to strive for to make the game more enjoyable... both for yourself, and everyone you come into contact with in Vives. |
Three sisters, born of the Sea
A sad fate t'was in store for thee
Oh Vaisha, Vahlah and Vallaesha |
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Re: Let's talk about roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 03:12 PM |
I'll get right to the point. For starters, the RP in Víves is usually very good. I'm proud to be a part of this world and to contribute in what small way I can in support of it.
I'm talking about RP integrity. This is a term I just invented (there's probably a better and more commonly used one, so bear with me) to describe consistency of play in PC's interactions with each other and the world.
Having RP integrity means acting IC at all times. Yes, I understand that some (()) is necessary. I also realize that it's fun to use tells occasionally for ooc reasons. Hell, I'm as guilty of that as anyone, but it's all in good fun, and I don't think it's ever taken away from the game itself. So I'd say that some ooc is acceptable, so long as it does not interfere with another's enjoyment of the game.
The onus for maintaining RP integrity rests on DM's and players. What happens when there are no DM's around? Does the world of Vives evaporate when there is no DM present? Do guards in Midor lose their authority when there's no DM to possess them? Do dragons lose their majesty and mystery when there's no DM to give them teeth? Is the threat of death meaningless when there is always a resurrection or respawn available?
When a tree falls in the woods, and no one is there to hear it, does it make a sound?
I'll give two examples to illustrate my point. These examples are not related to any particular instance.
1) A PC, let's call him Phil, enters Midor with trouble on his mind. He ends up killing a guard in a public area. Since no DM is present, the other guards don't react. Phil goes about his business in Midor and leaves with no one the wiser. We have one dead guard, one free criminal, and no one saw the crime, even though it was committed in broad daylight.
2) Another PC, let's call her Billie, sees her companions fall in the heat of battle. When the battle is over, she casts a resurrection spell on her fallen comrade, brining him back to life. She quickly drinks a healing potion and they move on to adventure further.
I could go on, but these two examples will do nicely.
In situation 1, we have Phil murdering a guard in Midor in broad day light. Were this a PnP adventure, the DM would have so many guards breathing down Phil's neck it would make his head spin. In NWN, however, there is nothing to prevent Phil from slaughtering a guard except RP integrity. Phil doesn't care that such an action would probably have been noticed by the other guards. He doesn't care that his action would have branded him as a criminal if a DM were around and that he would either be a fugitive from Midor or in Midor's jail. This is a case of Phil taking advantage of the limitations of persistent worlds and the NWN engine.
Situation number 2 it slightly different. Cleric's granting resurrections provide endless amounts of RP opportunity for the cleric. Clerics should not be mobile rez-o-matic machines. This is purely my own opinion, but clerics should actually be priests of their god. The priestly aspect should be included in the character concept. A cleric that does not pay tribute to his or her god is, again in my opinion, a poor cleric.
My goal here isn't to tell any how to RP your characters. That's not my job and I don't want anyone thinking that some nasty DM is trying to force his will on others. The fun I get from Vives involves facilitating, not dictating, RP. (of course, one caveat is that I will dictate events, even if they are negative, when characters choices and actions warrant.) But the DM's can't make Vives a truly living, breathing world without the help of the PC's. That requires thoughtful RP on behalf of everyone, DM's and PC's alike, as well as good communication from everyone in Vives.
I don't expect PC's to cower in fear every time they're approached by a guard. I'm not trying to force PC's into a rote RP cycle where certain stimuli always evokes certain responses. Our characters sometimes do things that surprise us. I know that old Mykal Vecar surprised me more then once. Consequences of IC should always be considered. If a character chooses to kill a guard, or rob a bank, or defile a temple, then that character had better be prepared to face the consequences.
Here's an example:
*Corrus looks up into the night sky and exhales nervously. He knows that what he is about to do may kill him, but he has no choice*
*Corrus grabs the hilt of his sword and marches up to the guard. He draws his sword*
Corrus: This is for my brother, Midoran slime!
*Corrus thrusts the sword into the guards gullet. The guard issues a gurgling noise, then slumps to the ground.*
*Corrus stands and waits for the guards to apprehend him*
The above RP exchange is a little far out, but it illustrates the kind of thoughtfulness that should accompany such extreme actions. Corrus's player knows that there are no DM's on, but he expects to be arrested for stabbing a guard in broad daylight. This is despite the fact that the other guards don't move (an AI issue) and he won't go to prison immediately (no DM online.)
I hope I am making myself clear. I do tend to ramble when I'm trying to make a point. I'll tell you this, though. No one is more passionate about making Vives an enjoyable place then I am. This place, more then any other I've ever seen, is worth our time and effort.
Thank you for taking the time to listen.
Mykal |
Most men lead lives of quiet desperation and go to the grave with the song still in them.
-Henry David Thoreau
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Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 03:18 PM |
Playing a role, even in death. Landru, you say a lot that sounds great, until the Not's. There is no not, a character will do as that character does, think and expect what the character will. A character can attack a guard and expect nothing to happen, maybe they hope to intimidate, maybe they consider themselves fearsome, or maybe they are just ignorant. They must accept the consequences, however.
Expecting a god to raise one, or treating them with contempt, is not OOC, nor is it not roleplaying. Characters believe what they believe.
Roleplaying allows anything to happen, but for a lot of things, it requires a DM, since they are the only ones who can give life to NPCs and gods. The Vives world is by the far the most detailed and pleasing I've seen. But, when a player tries to speak to NPCs and receives no feedback, even after great efforts, it takes away from the world and in general takes life out of NPCs. Once you've come to see NPCs as automatons, they lose meaning.
The only way around automaton NPCs from a players view is to either ignore them, or roleplay out their responses yourself(but NPCs fall under the domain of DMs, so anything you say or pretend them as saying back has no weight if a DM does not see it). A character should be able to do anything they try at hard enough, I say, and this requires some facilitating from DMs in some cases.
Anything OOC driven is not roleplaying, but anything coming from a characters desires and beliefs is.
But, players do have to worry about bugs and lag, which are OOC issues, and the characters do not deserve to die from them, and I've noticed the DMs are quite good about raising on OOC caused deaths. |
Eim Wioyu - errant knight of Midoran gone flipflop
Alinana Amraphen - shh |
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Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 03:18 PM |
On the topic of killing a guard and waiting for them to take you in, I say, run, but periodically leave DMs messages about what you've done.
Whenever I spoke to an NPC about something of slight importance, I would leave periodic messages in DM chat telling of what my character did or said in brief. |
Eim Wioyu - errant knight of Midoran gone flipflop
Alinana Amraphen - shh |
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 03:46 PM |
On the topic of killing a guard and waiting for them to take you in, I say, run, but periodically leave DMs messages about what you've done.
Whenever I spoke to an NPC about something of slight importance, I would leave periodic messages in DM chat telling of what my character did or said in brief.
Unfortunatly, Lal, this does no good if there is no DM online a the time. I would suggest never assuming that DM's will get your message if you use the DM chat. If you truely want to communicate something to the DM's, there's usually always on IRC. Website PM's are also useful.
On a side note, the only "not" in Landru's post The only "not" in Landru's post are as follows:
It's not the person who walks up and whacks on a Midor guard and then doesn't expect to be arrested, tried, and possibly executed (permanently). It's not treating a god casually, or even with contempt and expecting that god to do nothing to punish them. It means roleplaying death as if it were a very real thing, not a DM-click fix, or a click on the respawn button. It's not expecting that fix, it's planning to not need that fix, by employing common sense.
In other words, your chracters should do what you think she must do, but remember that certain actions will have consequences.
Mykal |
Most men lead lives of quiet desperation and go to the grave with the song still in them.
-Henry David Thoreau
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 03:52 PM |
I mean periodically send messages (like every hour or so, until you've gotten some response that a DM is aware), so a DM eventually finds out. So that killing a guard, for example, will mean guards will eventually come and get you, and that its not just consequence free.
And those are the 'nots' I'm talking about the rest of what Landru says is perfect and true. But a character could whack a guard and expect nothing, might not be smart or correct, but there are characters who are arrogant or ignorant.
But ya, reporting it in news, pm's or irc is a good idea too.
And even gods have to worry about consequences. I play my characters to death and beyond, I've had to do a lot of things with them I really haven't liked, but they disagreed with me, so .. *shrugs*
OH! and is this a good thread to discuss roleplay techniques one can use? Like I loved finding out about /dm /setdesc text, are there other things like that? And I have some things I do to help get around some of the limitations of the NWN engine to help roleplay, is this a good thread to discuss such? |
Eim Wioyu - errant knight of Midoran gone flipflop
Alinana Amraphen - shh |
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 04:03 PM |
Ideally for me Vives is a tapestry of stories which can be read as a whole book, or individual tales. It's threads are woven by us, the storytellers (players/dms alike), through our PCs lives, their toils, their quests, their interactions with others, their decisions (for good or ill). The level of depth the world has and that we give it depends on how immersed in our own stories (read: PCs personality/dailylife/choices and consenquences thereof/moral code...ect) we are.
IMO, 'good' RP is more than how your PC reacts when the DM possessed Ettin wants to eat you, or why your character would 'of course!' be able to convince it not to. How does your character speak to others? What do they do when they're alone? Do they have friends? What's going on in their personal lives? What's their previous experience with Ettins? Can they normally persuade (and I don't mean roll the right #) folks to do as they wish? If the answers to questions like that palpably effect the decision they make when faced with DM possessed Ettin (or another PC or a new area or...) that's good RP.
No good tale (being one that entertains it's listener/participant) is without it's memorable protagonists after all and I'm sure we can all list examples of characters that come to life for us (in books, on film, here in Vives), that are so ~real~ that we can sense them. What is it about those characters? They're living, breathing, Personalities.
In attempting to develop PCs with those qualities (to sense them fully myself, ultimately), I find it helps to RP their activities/thoughts/personality even when completely alone or dealing with scripted NPCs or fighting AI monsters or the like. Not only does that keep me IC (always interacting with the world as the PC would, based on -their- knowledge of it), it gives the world context for that PC....if a PC screams antagonistic curses every time they pass through Bloodwood, or prays to their God when doing particular things, it comes off as natural, believable, and consistant when witnessed by another (PC or DM) because it -is- how said PC would react.
It becomes part of their personality, giving the PC information about the world, a basis for reaction when speaking with others, deciding how/where to travel and who with....ie....Ettins should be killed on sight or -insert god/npc/moster of choice- is helpful/hurtful. [depending on success in previous situations, and I want to clarify here..I don't mean only when a DM is involved, I mean general interaction with the world, for example: Kree prayed to Kaldiar in various situations before he ever appeared to her IG and was overall successful in those. (Was able to sneak, did survive the monster, found the exact thing/place she wanted or some such...yes, ooc those are dice rolls/skill checks etc, but IC...) When encountering Kaldair for the first time her reactions were based on all those events, she trusted him, was instantly friendly with him, felt that she knew him...and if I remember right took place because her reaction to something (without me thinking about it) was to call on him for help.]
I find the PCs knowledge of the world increases this way as well. When RPing alone the PC has to work from what's scripted around it, therefore observing details they may not otherwise, things as simple as a lovely waterfall or swarm of butterflies that you can't manipulate in any way..but when noticed bring life, movement and depth, to the world. I've had great RP w/ others, came upon whole areas I'd never seen before, discovered hidden secrets and had a great impromptu DM interactions sprout from little things like that.....and it's these events..those that spring from who your PC is as a person, that make the stories of Vives and twine them into a cohesive pattern...the major plotlines or DM'd events tell the stories of that pattern. |
~ Kriayna Wildberry ~
-this post has in no way been paid for nor endorsed by PAJWT, The Broken Mask tavern, The Black Hand, or any other completely unrelated group- |
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 04 Jun 2004 05:37 PM |
Okay, I've had a day to let this digest, so let's see if I can articulate what I want to say here. To me, the characters that I "play" are first and foremost people. They're not a set of numbers and statistics, with a class and a mission. They're people...and as such, their motivations are emotionally and situationally driven, not static. In most cases, a person will not react in exactly the same way to the same situation all the time. Many factors will influence their response, and they will change as people as a result of what has happened to them in their lives.
In short, IMO good roleplay means that you aren't playing a character. It means that you are being a person, and tuning into their thoughts and feelings, their motivations and needs, and driving them accordingly. When I come in as one of my people, I am that person. I don't always like what they do or say, and I almost never agree with my principal characters motivations and driving forces. But..she is who she is Many times, there is no one to interact with when I am in game with her, so she sings in the square, tunes her lyre, goes to pray in various places, checks on her favorite spots, wanders home, goes shopping...She's carried out plotlines and conversations with the NPC's, even the ones that don't respond. She had a whole arrangement with Mr. Addams to sing at The Unicorn, and then had a situation where he asked her not to (in which I pretended he was talking, and answered back
Anyway, my whole point to this rambling is that people are not formulaic, at least in most cases. Good roleplay is not being formulaic in your approach to what your character will do, and how they will react. Many times, for me, it's not thought out and I have no idea how they will respond until they're in the situation. Then...it just happens. It takes a great deal of awareness, and sometimes we all fall down. I think it also takes a certain amount of being able to forget that we're "playing a game" and letting ourselves fall into the world. Some days that's easier than others, and it's great to have other players who are able to submerse themselves there to poke me when I start to get lazy.
And...that's my two dollars worth. |
Trishy
Macha Sparrowsong - Song is my life
Coretta Alandar - Cleric of Midoran
Dekla Debena - whatever
Not all people who wander are lost.
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 05 Jun 2004 12:07 AM |
Well...time for my little addition to a thread that I see as being very positive and beneficial for all players and dms.
I come from a long history of pnp games as well as muds and such. And therefore alot of what I see as roleplaying stems from that. In all honesty, other than one campaign I dm'd in pnp, it was all...get the loot...kill the baddies..and generally joke around. When I got into mudding, I was lucky enough to find a server that was very intensive to rp, and they taught me by example what it means to stay IC and roleplay your character. Whether its fair or not, my hope has always been to try and create an environment similar to text based roleplaying. Why you ask? Because it was all in what was typed. It was in the descriptions of each room in the mud. Every action you made, you typed in. Rarely, just hitting a button. There where no pretty lights and colors. If you wanted pretty lights, you typed the pretty lights. You emersed yourself in the description of the city, not letting a high graphic environment dictate what you saw. An example would be the area transition descriptions in Vives...some of the best I have found btw..... That is a good example of what the feel of text based was. It is a large city...full of travellers, traders, and residents. Guards watching the street corners. Children playing near the fountain..etc etc... If we where to populate Midor with all the npcs that you would actually see in a city, it would be the grandest lag monster known to mankind. So what do we do? Do we go by the fact that we only see a few traders and guards in the city, because that is all the engine will allow? Or do we play it like it is a metropolis? To me, that is roleplaying. Emmersing yourself not only in what the graphics of the game allow, but truly emmersing yourself in the world. You don't have to strike up conversations with commoners that aren't there. You don't have to pause and wait for the invisible cart of goods making its way to the blacksmith. But you have to set in your minds eye, that more is going on there than the few npcs that are seen. This is a rough example...and by no means the only way to handle a situation.
*Coruva steps through the main gates of Midor, wiping the sweat from his eyes. Blood still slowly dripping from a fresh wound across his shoulder. He slowly passes through the entryway, keeping a watchful eye on the brigade of guards surveying the city from their perch on the battlements.
He now walks into the courtyard
*He stops as he enters the busy courtyard. His eyes sifting through the throngs of merchants and citizens, finally catching sight of the shining white robes of Blanche Labelle, standing idely at the steps of the temple of Midoran*
I know..I know...some would say that overkilling with emotes is pointless and mundane. But for me its an underused tool. It does two things. One, it helps me immerse myself within the environment. Two, it helps bring other characters that are near into that same place. To me, it adds flavor. It tells mood, health, physical characteristics, that a graphical game like this can never tell. It creates that immersion that helps focus all of us on roleplaying rather than relying on pictures. And really...it sure beats the heck out of Coruva running through the gates of Midor and immediately up to Blanche whos is standing before the temple of Midoran.
What I am getting at, after probably typing way too much...is that while there are things that require dm attention to help increase rp in the game. Each and every one of you can add flavor of your own. And trust me...personally, I am much more tempted to begin to interact with a player while I am on as a dm when they are interacting with their environment, rather than those that are just out running through areas with little thought of their surroundings.
On a side note though. Some of you do it wonderfully. I literally can sit and watch some players for hours on end just interacting with their environment and with other players. It is really a joy to see people immersing themselves within the world that all of us...not just the admin and dms, have created. |
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 15 Oct 2005 02:39 PM |
Ka-bump!
Since I'm done all my work and trying to still look busy, I took the time to read though the General forum (yep, all 35 pages), anywho, I cam across a few threads (including this one):
1. Roleplaying Tips 2: Things to do in the city
This is a neet little list that you can spend your time doing while in Midor or Port Royale. A lot of what is posted there can be done with just a little creativity from the player and without DM involvement (cause we probably all bother them enough...sorry Sol! )
2. Roleplaying suggestions
This one is by Tas, and although Barnas' opinion may have changed (I hope not!) I, of course, agree with him - even about the CHA. CHA is about socialness /and/ physical beauty. I really dislike when people say it is not about physical beauty (hold back the flames until I'm done). No doubt, people like playing someone that is more attractive then themselves personally but they don't want to waste combat stats in CHA *rolls eyes*. Sure it is fine for you to have a CHA of 6 and say you have a 'handsome' character but to me it is rubbish (but really, what does my opinion matter - cause you're never going to change it).
I made Juylina with 15 CHA, 14 DEX, 12 STR, 14 WIS (or something really close to that) but it would just seem stupid to have a CHA of 8 and say she is so beautiful. Level ups went into DEX, STR and WIS (I believe) and it kinda screws me for ever getting level 9 spells but points are supposed to go where the RP dictates them to go, not where you're more powerful.
((Sorry! That is probably my most hated thing I see people doing with regards to RP - not playing stats - especially CHA)).
3. Ten Commandments of a Roleplayer
Another one by Aria, but this is a good thread to keep in mind (even though it is a bit general). It is very applicable to an NWN persistent world, so have a quick glance.
One thing I comment on is 7 (speak your mind) in regards to 5 (Not to ruin people's fun). Something I try really hard to do is to stay quiet at times to allow other people to get to do both 7 and 5. I'm a quick typer and I could probably drown some slower typers out with my excessive emoting and Juylina's tendency to never shut up. *shrugs* Probably really not IC for Juylina, but we're all here for fun :).
Now on to this thread.
What is good RP?
To me good RP is always staying in character and reacting. The one of the best types of RP is reaction RP. Why do I like this kind of RP? Because it tends to the type of RP that the quiet RPers do. The quiet RPers are probably the most underappreciated RPers in any PW environment (I'm not one of them *points up* my ranting is hardly quiet - I have an opinion and I think it is best if you hear it). The quiet ones are sometimes forgotten/left behind/what have you, but I think it is important to watch these players because they are usually the ones that complain about nothing and get total enjoyment out of all their time while they play
I also really like player driven events - ones that can be done without a DM. I love these events, both as a player creating them and participating in others and as a former DM seeing the players take initiative in trying to create fun for not just themselves but a large portion of the player base.
And of course the obvious thing is staying IC.
It's staying in character all the time, even when nobody's watching.
Yes it is! Who cares if you’re by yourself? Pull that umbrella out when it starts to rain, curse at the bear the cut you deeply or cringe your nose up at those stinky smelly elves. Who knows when a DM might be watching to fire you a couple of EXP (sorry that’s just the hook) but who even cares about EXP, just roleplay and stay IC because that is what you want to do. I don’t RP because a DM might be watching; I do it because I enjoy it. And so should all of you; that’s why you’re on a RP server, right?
It's about being true to what your character would do, in all situations. It's the paladin who won't open a crate in a house and loot it, even when there's nobody around. It's the good cleric who won't resurrect an evil character. It's the player who doesn't walk up to a character they've never met and call them by their name because it's displayed above their head. It's about being completely ignorant about something the character doesn't know about, although the player has been reading the story in great detail on the forums. It's all of these things, but primarily, it's consistent... It doesn't vary according to who's watching, or what's known ooc, or what might be gained otherwise.
Yes I do know that I’m agreeing with someone who’s not likely to read it but Agreed!
Mykal’s post also details some good points on RP integrity (which led to the post about doing things just because you think there is no DM around to respond)
Consequences of IC should always be considered. If a character chooses to kill a guard, or rob a bank, or defile a temple, then that character had better be prepared to face the consequences.
Amen. These type of player non-realizations usually lead to the “DM X greifed me” type posts. *rolls eyes* Vives, like most RP PW, is a living, breathing world and will push back if you push first. But that is part of the fun. Die at the hands of the “Destroy of Worlds Paul” then roll with it. Figure out what happened and why? Why is there so many undead in there, why is that dragon there, etc. You don’t have to win all the time, you can let others win. One of my favorite RP event thingys (a non Vives example coming up) was when my cleric of Talos came back from hell and lost her connection to her god. She went for about a month without casting spells and it was fun involving others in trying to help her, trying to change her and trying to kill her (this was all done without a DM at all – aside from the hell trip)…dang, I wish I could go back to those days. Since I derailed my own post, what I was trying to get at is loosing can be fun!
The last one (to go along with the above one) is to accept the DM’s direction on your RP. I’m not saying that you should dictate your RP based upon what DM’s say at all stops but if you get into trouble with giants, mushroom men, or an army of stinky elves then roll with it and RP accordingly (reaction RP!).
Trishy really hits the nail on the head with what she said. I really can’t add any more to what she said, it is near perfect.
And as a final quote, I’ll leave you with this one: Vives is here to give a backdrop to the players who roleplay in it.
What's bad roleplay?
It’s basically doing the opposite of what is posted above :P. I think everyone knows what is bad RP, so I don’t want to waste too much time with that.
But one thing that is quite bad is forcing people into your RP. It might be as simple as a “You cower in fear as you gaze upon this person” in your description to a more direct approach of a tell saying “I stabbed you in the back and you die.” Eww. I hate hate hate it. Ewww!
Ideas about roleplay here in general
I think the best idea for roleplay is to tell every elf you meet that they smell very badly. Especially any who’s name’s start with the letter E, oh also, anyone that hangs around with elves probably smells quite badly too.
*has visions of Benny polishing up the ol’smite stick*
Heh, really though, I’m not sure what to add here at the moment. I’m sure I’ll think of something soon and post it though!
Alright, that is the end of my long rant. This is not directed towards anyone it is just me ranting on about RP.
P.S. Elves are awesome.
P.P.S. Also, this isn't a 'Lets just agree with him to shut up up' type thread, it a 'lets dispute him to quicken this long borning day and give him something to respond to'! ;) |
Juylina Komthya | Portrait - Priestess of Naruth |
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 15 Oct 2005 07:09 PM |
Only been here for two days, but I have a few things to share :)
1. Involving people
Few people RP all alone. I know the DM's tend to love it but I just don't have the energy. The odd emote and verbal comment, sure, but not as if another PC or PC's were there. Thus I like to team up with other PC's even for things I could do solo. First off it provides a more fun RP experience, and secondly it can get sidetracked, change direction and so on. I've been in situations where an expedition to gather some quick gold and potions has turned into a 2+ hour adventure, because of the group interacting. Wich of course was way more fun than a simple raid for loot :)
2. Rant on acting in character
The battle between the character and the gamer, as I like to call it. On non-rp server, gamers make their characters take the best multiclasses, save up skill points and so on. This is often so obviously bad rp that I think people recognize it as such when seen on an RP server.
What can be hard though is adding yet more disadvantageous quirks to your character. For example Marrya told Nevron last night about how much money there is to make from skin crafting. But he decided he wouldn't do it, and gave her any skins she wanted from the animals they killed. Why? Because he didn't want to dirty his hands with such simple tasks. In his mind neither real men nor wizards should spend their time making clothesIt's going to affect his economy negatively, but at the same time it adds to his personality, and that's what I think matter the most on an RP server.
Well, rant over. Maybe the server has gone up by now... :) |
Nevron Tel
Malander
"If we are to survive, a new balance must be found. In normal times, evil would be fought by good. But in times like these, well, it should be fought by another kind of evil." - Chronicles of Riddick |
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 15 Oct 2005 07:25 PM |
1. Involving people
Few people RP all alone. I know the DM's tend to love it but I just don't have the energy. The odd emote and verbal comment, sure, but not as if another PC or PC's were there. Thus I like to team up with other PC's even for things I could do solo. First off it provides a more fun RP experience, and secondly it can get sidetracked, change direction and so on. I've been in situations where an expedition to gather some quick gold and potions has turned into a 2+ hour adventure, because of the group interacting. Wich of course was way more fun than a simple raid for loot :)
I do know what you're saying. Vives (as most PWs claim) is a place to party and RP with others, but you still sometimes find yourself alone.
2. Rant on acting in character
The battle between the character and the gamer, as I like to call it. On non-rp server, gamers make their characters take the best multiclasses, save up skill points and so on. This is often so obviously bad rp that I think people recognize it as such when seen on an RP server.
What can be hard though is adding yet more disadvantageous quirks to your character. For example Marrya told Nevron last night about how much money there is to make from skin crafting. But he decided he wouldn't do it, and gave her any skins she wanted from the animals they killed. Why? Because he didn't want to dirty his hands with such simple tasks. In his mind neither real men nor wizards should spend their time making clothesIt's going to affect his economy negatively, but at the same time it adds to his personality, and that's what I think matter the most on an RP server.
Well, rant over. Maybe the server has gone up by now... :)
Heh, agreed MSM. Leave the skining to the peasants. Quirks are what make characters fun and interesting (along the lines of losing) instead of "Evil Mage Number 4002" even if they are negative ones. |
Juylina Komthya | Portrait - Priestess of Naruth |
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 16 Oct 2005 10:28 AM |
One key thing that I believe cannot be stressed enough is the fact that players can actually drive their own stories and adventures.
The Nature Rambles, for example, come to mind. It's is all player driven.
You don't have to wait for a DM to drop something into your lap.
- Paul |
Purpose in life: finding better ways of allowing players to kill themselves. Repeatedly.
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"...Cause he mixes it with love
And makes the world taste good."
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<@James42> Lawful good isn't in your vocabulary, it's on your menu.
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 16 Oct 2005 10:51 AM |
P.S. Elves are awesome.
Oh, that is sneaky. |
Juylina Komthya | Portrait - Priestess of Naruth |
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 04 Nov 2005 08:01 PM |
Hmmm...Hoping to add to this, even though I just signed on to the board today, and haven't even put in a registration or played yet. But this thread is very thought-provoking, and a very pleasant surprise...
Good rp leads to the unexpected. In the server I was on, a chance meeting on a streetcorner led to sharing a drink, several hours of intricate conversation, and making a friend that I'll always treasure. The rp took both of our characters in directions that was completely unexpected...but made them both come alive in ways that I had never really experienced before. It was like being in the midst of a really good novel, except we were both contributing to the story interactively, adding depth and richness, and constantly challenging each other to make things as real as possible.
From what I've read here, and in other posts, this is the type of experience that is encouraged and almost...expected to happen here. I find that tremendously exciting, and really look forward to hopefully playing and having great amounts of fun with the folks here. It sounds like this is a real community, where people are true to their characters and support each other in pursuit of fun and an enriching experience. |
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 04 Nov 2005 08:17 PM |
Hmmm...Hoping to add to this, even though I just signed on to the board today, and haven't even put in a registration or played yet. But this thread is very thought-provoking, and a very pleasant surprise...
Good rp leads to the unexpected. In the server I was on, a chance meeting on a streetcorner led to sharing a drink, several hours of intricate conversation, and making a friend that I'll always treasure. The rp took both of our characters in directions that was completely unexpected...but made them both come alive in ways that I had never really experienced before. It was like being in the midst of a really good novel, except we were both contributing to the story interactively, adding depth and richness, and constantly challenging each other to make things as real as possible.
From what I've read here, and in other posts, this is the type of experience that is encouraged and almost...expected to happen here. I find that tremendously exciting, and really look forward to hopefully playing and having great amounts of fun with the folks here. It sounds like this is a real community, where people are true to their characters and support each other in pursuit of fun and an enriching experience.
What can i say... You started the best way possible. |
Why search around when the answer is within you...?
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 04 Nov 2005 08:28 PM |
What can i say... You started the best way possible.
Sure did. |
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Re: Some of my thoughts on what is roleplaying
Posted: 05 Nov 2005 03:21 AM |
*stops lurking for a little while*
Heya folks. Nice thread, and one I dont remember reading before. Given the topic, seemed worth linking to another old thread that I know some folks, myself included, found very useful.
RP hints and tips
Cheers,
Sirac
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'The bond that links your true family is not one of blood, but of respect and joy in each other's life. Rarely do members of one family grow up under the same roof.' - Richard Bach, Illusions. |
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