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Vives: The World View
Posted: 30 Jun 2003 12:37 AM |
Hello all. My name is Catcher and I'm an inveterate meddler. :wink: Since I asked about the history and geography of the Vives Realm and got pointers to several individual histories and sources, I asked if I could volunteer to try and collect them all and fill in the gaps. Aria suggested I go ahead and post questions here, so here I am. 
I called the topic The World View because that's what I [u:d55985bf50]haven't[/u:d55985bf50] been able to find, as of yet. I understand this PW is just entering the Beta stage, but developing a solid World View now will help DMs create and link quests, builders create new fascinating areas, and draw players back to play again and again. My first question is: am I far off the mark or is there a need for this? If there is a need, I have a quick and dirty list of areas to cover. Check it out and feel free to add comments as you see the need. The list is in roughly priority order, so that I'd want to establish the first item on the list solid before going on to the second and so on.
1. Hook - What story feature (not game feature) sets Vives apart?
2. Realm Size and Location- How big physically (mi/km) is the Vives World? Where is it in relation to other land masses, oceans, and poles on the planet?
3. Physical Geography - Where are the mountains, volcanoes, hills, and plains located? How were they formed and how large?
4. Climatology - Where are the ocean currents and prevailing winds in Vives and what type (wet/dry, warm/cold)? What areas are tropical, sub-tropical, temperate, sub-arctic, and arctic.
5. Hydrography - Where do the rains fall and how much? Where are the major rivers, lakes, other waterways?
6. Ecology - Where are the plants and animals located and of what type? This will include placement of forests, swamps, fertile valleys, and wastes.
7. Ethnology - What races are dominant where and what general culture do they have? This should include PC races as well as whatever "monstrous" races might hold dominion in varios areas of Vives.
8. Politics - What nations control what areas and how are they governed? Who are they allied with, wary of, at war with?
9. Economics - How do the peoples of an area earn their living? Are they materially rich or poor? Traders or self-sufficient?
10. Theology - What are the Gods and Goddesses? How are they organised? Who serves them and how?
Whew! 8O That'll teach ya. :lol: :wink: |
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[No Subject]
Posted: 30 Jun 2003 12:37 AM |
Hmmm...either this is A) A really cool person into RP'ing and world creation (if so welcome aboard :D), or this is an Admin in disguise (*coughariacough*) :P.
Either way I'll answer some myself, taking creative freedom and all...I'll reply again soon (hopfully in a few hours/tonight) with a few stuff to fill in the gaps, just minor stuff though from what I've seen in areas/world map/gods/etc.
~Fenarisk |
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[No Subject]
Posted: 30 Jun 2003 12:37 AM |
[i:a95a0fed39][color=olive:a95a0fed39]Congratulations Catcher! Someone thought you're as logical as me :D
I'm at work right now, but I guess this is what'll be occupying me the the rest of the night :P
Thanks Catcher, it's a very nice way to organize the information.[/color:a95a0fed39][/i:a95a0fed39] |
Aria
So talented, so troubled. |
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[No Subject]
Posted: 30 Jun 2003 12:37 AM |
I agree with what you have brought up Catcher and that is Vives still needs alot work in the story/history department. It sounds like Catcher wants a job to do. I say we should let the man work! :P
Alot of these things are ingame already. IE. There are some gods that haven't been released to the public yet. There is a slighty out of date world map. There is also some ideas floating around about politics and how theology works but it hasn't really all been put in black and white yet. It would be great to start getting all this information written and organized. |
I do what the voices in my head tell me too. |
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[No Subject]
Posted: 30 Jun 2003 12:37 AM |
A few more headings to add to your load ... (heehee)
* Gazeteer of hamlets, towns and cities
* Bestiary
well done lad
McGurk |
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[No Subject]
Posted: 30 Jun 2003 12:37 AM |
:oops: (Closest I can get to a blush emote)
Now you all are just going to swell my head. :wink:
Fenarisk: I can definitely rule out B, just check out Ladies of Neverwinter where I've been an active member for over a year. As to A, I'd like to think I'm decent at world creation, though the list I set out is not exactly my own creation. A large portion of the guidance is taken from the World Builder's Guidebook by Richard Baker (TSR 1996). I've just simplified and generalised some of the points. I'll be glad to take whatever information you have.
Aria: You invited me, now we'll see how long it takes for you to get tired of me. :wink: Seriously, Culia Banii is not going anywhere without help and that doesn't seem to be coming right now, so I thought I'd make myself useful for something.
Gorak: From reading, I figured that several things were "in game", but with a slow dialup connect and a 50 MB hak still to download, it will be a while before I'm in game. That's why I figured I'd post here since most of you could share what is there and I can get to work without having to wait on my connection. I'll be checking several of the posts here that Aria has pointed out but if you know of some others, feel free to point away.
McGurk: You wouldn't be taking joy at others misfortune would you? A cynic after my own heart! :lol: Thanks for adding the items, though I personally would consider them part of Politics and Ecology respectively, they are both important components. I'll keep them in mind in organizing the more detailed section.
One question for all: Should I start marking items as general (known by players) and private (known by DMs) now or should I just compile it then worry about editing the document for public consumption? |
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[No Subject]
Posted: 30 Jun 2003 12:37 AM |
[i:2958a821b6][color=olive:2958a821b6]I guess I'm keeping this colloquial and informal here, just throwing preliminary and not so preliminary ideas out at one another. Can't I think with my heart instead of my head sometimes? ;)
Before I start on talking about the 'story feature that sets Vives apart', I'd want to start on some things that mayhaps comes even before that (and thus influences such), some little tidbits I have to offer in guiding Vives' development.[/color:2958a821b6][/i:2958a821b6]
[b:2958a821b6][color=darkred:2958a821b6]Aria's First Wish.[/color:2958a821b6][/b:2958a821b6]
I strongly believe that myth is an eternal mirror in which we see ourselves, that these stories we dream, characters we role-play, have something to say [b:2958a821b6]about[/b:2958a821b6] each of us, and something to say [b:2958a821b6]to[/b:2958a821b6] each of us.
To that end, I'd love to see us having storylines with themes that touches upon different aspects of life, in a slightly deeper way than the treatment of normal fantasy novels. I would like to see Vives as not only as 'Ideas about Adventures', but more so as an 'Adventure about Ideas'.
[b:2958a821b6][color=darkred:2958a821b6]Aria's Second Wish.[/color:2958a821b6][/b:2958a821b6]
At the same time, I also believe in an open appreciation of both history and culture, not only of classical (Western classical) origins, but also others - far-east, polynesian, african... They strikes me not only as intellectually stimulating, but also have an encapturing beauty to it...
"But when you walk the footsteps of a stranger, you learn things you never knew you never knew".
[b:2958a821b6][color=darkred:2958a821b6]Aria's Third Wish.[/color:2958a821b6][/b:2958a821b6]
This seems to be an underlying assumption for every discussion, but one I think is quite relevant in guiding further discussions. [b:2958a821b6]The overarching worldview has to be logical and coherent[/b:2958a821b6]. Undoubtedly we will encounter 'cool' things along the way that we [b:2958a821b6]could[/b:2958a821b6] add in, but ultimately whether it [b:2958a821b6]should[/b:2958a821b6] be add in should be examined in the light of every existing thing in place, their relation and contradictory.
I would hate to end with an incomprehensible, indefensible contradictory 'reality'.
[b:2958a821b6][color=darkred:2958a821b6]Implications on the Preliminary Ideas[/b:2958a821b6][/color:2958a821b6]
The preliminary ideas on the background and story of Vives is guided by the above; some of it have been distributed back in January to selected people, but some are outdated, and most are inaccessible. I'll try to list a couple of ideas and show how they are guided by the above Wishes.
[color=green:2958a821b6]Temporal Background[/color:2958a821b6]. -Our- human civilization have undergone several distinct 'ages' of thoughts. Most fantasy stories focusses on one specific era - in particular, an age where Faith dominates. The world may be torn asunder, but how the inhabitants think about the world does not change. Gods may die, and others will rise - but at the end of the day, it's all the same story.
Episode One set Vives in this same Age of Faith, but much closer to the Age of Reason, where different ways of thinking about life can be conceived. Are the gods real? Are they omnipotent? Are they benevolent? What happens to evil then? What about freedom, or free will? What about free will's companion, Responsibility? How does these affect the characters' lives, and what choices would they make in face of it all?
It's hard to pin down a specific historical period that I've had in mind, but Renaissance is probably the closest (or descriptive) one can get (as opposed to the Dark Ages setting in most fantasies). In my mind this [i:2958a821b6]possibility of change[/i:2958a821b6] is probably the largest thing that sets our setting apart from other fantasies. I feel this offers much avenues for meaningful exploration and allows continued, sustained, and fundamental development of the lands.
[color=green:2958a821b6]Races, their Myths, History, Language and Politics[/color:2958a821b6]. Here several limitations exist, the most significant one is probably the fact that we have to accomodate for the NwN engine (so we don't get to choose what is to be there). Apart from that, I'm very inclined to have a dominantly Human population in the land (same reason as other DnD campaigns - adaptive and flexibility).
I'd love to see certain creation myths / language & philosophy / politics being somewhat inspired by / adapted from real-life counterparts (not necessarily all from one timeframe-geographical location). This not only lend a subtle, exoric flavor to the different races, but also provide a simple, concrete guideline as to how players can extend and expand upon them.
[i:2958a821b6][color=olive:2958a821b6]Very late here... still haven't got to the core part of the questions. Oh well, let me know what you think so far :D[/color:2958a821b6][/i:2958a821b6] |
Aria
So talented, so troubled. |
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[No Subject]
Posted: 30 Jun 2003 12:37 AM |
[quote:c3b1254ba3="Aria"][i:c3b1254ba3][color=olive:c3b1254ba3]I guess I'm keeping this colloquial and informal here, just throwing preliminary and not so preliminary ideas out at one another. Can't I think with my heart instead of my head sometimes? ;)
Before I start on talking about the 'story feature that sets Vives apart', I'd want to start on some things that mayhaps comes even before that (and thus influences such), some little tidbits I have to offer in guiding Vives' development.[/color:c3b1254ba3][/i:c3b1254ba3][/quote:c3b1254ba3]
Just an interjection here, this whole process will be very informal. The plan, as it stands now, is for me to post some initial impressions/findings for each of the areas mentioned above in the DM Section of the Forum (so that players won't be able to see it). Any and all parts will be subject to review, editing, additions and comments by the Builders and DMs. After an acceptable period has passed (open to suggestions on this), I'll write up a draft of the Section with areas marked Staff Only (for DMs and Builders) and General. That way, we can generate docs for players who are interested in certain or all areas and have full docs for the Vives Staff. The Draft will also be presented for approval, additions, and edits before becoming final. Even final status will still be subject to revision; I want this to be an aid, not a rulebook or a straitjacket.
[quote:c3b1254ba3="Aria"][b:c3b1254ba3][color=darkred:c3b1254ba3]Aria's First Wish.[/color:c3b1254ba3][/b:c3b1254ba3]
I strongly believe that myth is an eternal mirror in which we see ourselves, that these stories we dream, characters we role-play, have something to say [b:c3b1254ba3]about[/b:c3b1254ba3] each of us, and something to say [b:c3b1254ba3]to[/b:c3b1254ba3] each of us.
To that end, I'd love to see us having storylines with themes that touches upon different aspects of life, in a slightly deeper way than the treatment of normal fantasy novels. I would like to see Vives as not only as 'Ideas about Adventures', but more so as an 'Adventure about Ideas'.[/quote:c3b1254ba3]
Not asking for much, are you? :wink: I'll do my best to reflect that quality in all the material I see. However, right now I'm proceeding with a philosophy primarily of gathering what the others have written. I may fill in some of the bigger gaps, but I'm too new to the Community to start doing much of my own writing.
[quote:c3b1254ba3="Aria"][b:c3b1254ba3][color=darkred:c3b1254ba3]Aria's Second Wish.[/color:c3b1254ba3][/b:c3b1254ba3]
At the same time, I also believe in an open appreciation of both history and culture, not only of classical (Western classical) origins, but also others - far-east, polynesian, african... They strikes me not only as intellectually stimulating, but also have an encapturing beauty to it...
"But when you walk the footsteps of a stranger, you learn things you never knew you never knew".[/quote:c3b1254ba3]
My own studies have been in the European tradition, but I do try to branch out to a complex of traditions. This will probably become more important around the Ethnology and Politics stages, but I'll keep it in mind throughout.
[quote:c3b1254ba3="Aria"][b:c3b1254ba3][color=darkred:c3b1254ba3]Aria's Third Wish.[/color:c3b1254ba3][/b:c3b1254ba3]
This seems to be an underlying assumption for every discussion, but one I think is quite relevant in guiding further discussions. [b:c3b1254ba3]The overarching worldview has to be logical and coherent[/b:c3b1254ba3]. Undoubtedly we will encounter 'cool' things along the way that we [b:c3b1254ba3]could[/b:c3b1254ba3] add in, but ultimately whether it [b:c3b1254ba3]should[/b:c3b1254ba3] be add in should be examined in the light of every existing thing in place, their relation and contradictory.
I would hate to end with an incomprehensible, indefensible contradictory 'reality'.[/quote:c3b1254ba3]
In Science Fiction, we call it "suspension of disbelief" and I strongly believe it works in Fantasy as well. Certainly you can explain many illogical constructions with "magic" or "divine/infernal power" or other standards, but when they're too plentiful, they lose their potency. Further, going back to your First Wish, we can only speak to our players through the common themes of all times : Hope, Fear, Love, Hate, Friendship, Betrayal, etc. These are constants all cultures and time periods live by. I'll comment on some of the other aspects later when I've had some more time to consider them, but thanks for the guidance. :) |
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[No Subject]
Posted: 30 Jun 2003 12:37 AM |
| [i:4ffa035aac][color=olive:4ffa035aac] I've took the liberty to move the pair of Vives Background post to a forum open to everybody - I feel this would encourage player inputs, as well as give them a flavor of what to expect. [/color:4ffa035aac][/i:4ffa035aac] |
Aria
So talented, so troubled. |
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[No Subject]
Posted: 30 Jun 2003 12:37 AM |
| Just in case I get bored or run out of things to do, I think I'll add another section titled Classes. This will cover things like sources of the different classes (what makes a sorceror?, what orders spawn monks or paladins? In what regions do barbarians occur?), society's view of those classes, the position, if any, of prestige classes, etc. BTW, Aria (or Ara or Fen or ...), let me know when I'm getting close to anything you [b:7588c9084c]don't[/b:7588c9084c] want generally discussed. I'll start all the "Vives: ..." threads here unless otherwise requested. |
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